NavList:

Hi Gary

Yes, I would have understood a basic artificial horizon using some sort of fluid – the dangers of mercury weren’t known then so mercury as the liquid sounds reasonable and yes I have read elsewhere in other text artificial horizons use on land also by surveyors. So, we can throw out the bit of journalese licence about gyroscopic artificial horizons – yes I knew about the U-boats had a cumbersome gyroscopic artificial horizon.

However, the elephant in the room during my read of this account was “an accurate position being plotted whilst the ship was stable – locked in ice and drifting sometimes 60 nms a day” – so we are not talking about essentially being on a stable platform without a good horizon – but I presume an artificial horizon would have been available – so my question to you marine specialists – with very long, long dusk and twilights a raft of stars would have been available including planets, the moon even if the sun was so low as to be in-accurate because of atmospheric optical errors.

Could accurate fix information be available with the equipment and mathematic tables available – I am not yet cognisant on available tables to comment – I am reading as fast as I can and gaining info.

David C –

My log book isn’t readily available but I graduated from RNZAF Nav School in 1975 and was on Bristol Freighters for a year – so 75/76 - the track was approx. 108 True – and I wish I had kept the logs of that but alas no. Or diary entries as I do now.

Could we home in on an AM station – they were available but have a look at the bottom of the South Island of NZ – there is a huge lump of granite between the station and coming in from Hobart – however, no doubt at least it is likely a weak average point may have kept out nose pointed that way. Also we were visual below clouds but we did keep far enough south to enable us not to need to use Mt Cook in our safety height – however, that was well over 10k the top of the no oxygen height we were allowed to go in a BF.

RNZAF use the Royal Air Force AP1234A Manual of Navigation Vol 1 for navigation training and I still have my copy Ministry of Defence 1967 manual which they let me keep. It is a gem but I believe Chichester’s DR techniques would have been incorporated.

When I flew my Dakota flight to Norfolk – no I had no interest, at that time, in polar exploration – remembering the internet and Amazon and easy access to books was a loooong way off. However, that was the year I bought my 1st hand held calculator/computer – the TI & then the HP 41CV  - so I was already experimenting with computerised Astro calculations. And yes we were taught the offset method of finding an island – the offset method was a very good search and rescue technique used for maritime searching which we did a lot of in NZ being surrounded by a lot of ocean. However, Norfolk had a very good NDB beacon BUT that was off – we were not allowed to use it – the check navigator used it to check our position but we were not allowed to use it. Again, we didn’t offset but we were taught the technique. We flew grid navigation flights out of Christchurch – i.e. used the gyro-compass in gyro mode – again useful for polar navigation.

I was posted to LRMP Orions after BF – a very different ocean flying aircraft – but we used for real all navigation techniques taught at the school – The Orion’s were the mainstay SAR resource available to NZ Govt and maritime rescues were common.

I remember the Whitbread Round the world yacht race 81-82 ( based on my time on Sqdn) – we had to go find them as they headed along the Roaring Forties from Cape Town to Auckland GC route we had to fly out and find the 1st 2 or 3 lead yachts – I was navigator – no GPS or radar fixes – Astro and LORAN – we found them – I remember telling the captain as we found the lead boat not to fly directly to the next boat and give away direction info so we offset to come in from the north – we had radar and could pick up the boats from 100 nms plus so could do that once we knew their approx. latitude.

Great years of flying – we were launched when the ANZ Mt Erubus hit Terra Firma on MT Erebus – we got airborne and were to land at Christchurch to refuel and collect our cold weather survival gear – but they found the crash site before we landed – almost got to go to the pole.

“ I have three editions of DCT Bennett's Complete Air Navigator. - 1940, 1954 & 1967. This deals with British practice. Are you familiar wih this book? Did the RNZAF follow British or US practice?”

DCT Bennett - an Australian – Path Finder Leader – yes – read his biography – autobiography – and lovingly looked at how to get those books - I will find and get. I have read a dozen books on Pathfinders – and new ones come out yearly – my history notwithstanding my navigation – was my dad was a PF – on Mosies – 75 missions over Germany 2.5 tours

Looking at dad’s log book now –

PF raid to Berlin
Berlin Mar 1, 2,4,6,8,,11,13,15,16,18,19,21,23,24,27,30
1945 – April 2 – Berlin
April 3 – Berlin
April 17 – Berlin
April 20 – Berlin – last raid on Berlin of war overtop at 30,000 ft saw it fall to Russian troops
May 2 – Kiel – Last raid of the war

And here we are again Russia and Ukraine!!!

Bit hard to get this air navigation bug out of my system or flying in general.

Regards Howard G